Question of Voting

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4 years ago
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Tyssen
Tyssen Pic3989 Posts
AustraliaBrisbane
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Does the word Tradition mean anything to you. It's something that should not be modified or tampered with

That's crap!!! I fucking hate it when people cling to 'traditions' no matter how old, archaic or even downright dangerous they are. Stoning adulterers is a tradition, female circumcision with blunt rocks is a tradition, not allowing women into public bars was a tradition not so long ago. Not all traditions are good and in my opinion most of 'em could do with being revised on a regular basis to assess their value in modern societies.
4 years ago
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dB
spacefunky Pic7236 Posts
Canada
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In reply to

Does the word Tradition mean anything to you. It's something that should not be modified or tampered with

That's crap!!! I fucking hate it when people cling to 'traditions' no matter how old, archaic or even downright dangerous they are. Stoning adulterers is a tradition, female circumcision with blunt rocks is a tradition, not allowing women into public bars was a tradition not so long ago. Not all traditions are good and in my opinion most of 'em could do with being revised on a regular basis to assess their value in modern societies.

hear hear thumbsup
4 years ago
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Jobi
jobi Pic3626 Posts
USAAsheville once again
Music Style Glitchy snorbcore
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In reply to
In reply to

Does the word Tradition mean anything to you. It's something that should not be modified or tampered with

That's crap!!! I fucking hate it when people cling to 'traditions' no matter how old, archaic or even downright dangerous they are. Stoning adulterers is a tradition, female circumcision with blunt rocks is a tradition, not allowing women into public bars was a tradition not so long ago. Not all traditions are good and in my opinion most of 'em could do with being revised on a regular basis to assess their value in modern societies.

hear hear thumbsup
There's too many redniecks around here flying the rebel flag thinking the can lynch black people "because it's out heritage."  Fuck that shit.
4 years ago
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joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
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No dB, its not about how much you say/write. its about how sound/logical/practical it is.


i never said it was... you were the one that mentioned the size of my statement.

 

as for sound: there are many... many different systems of democratic government that i would deem better than the american way. logical: i stated a logical arguement based on the flaws in your system of election.  since what i'm talking about is hypothetical in nature (because we both know that your electoral system won't change) practicallity doesn't come into play here.  although it would be practical and in your best interest to have your vote mean more on a smaller scale.

 

you still haven't said anything to opose this and debate why this system of election is a good one.


damn, buy some records, practice mixing, take up producing or something. At least take up a hobby if you don't love the music that much. we wouldn't have gotten this far posting this much if you were just simply explained why you think our voting system sucked with your first post (i wouldn't reply to to your post if you did that). Seriously, I don't give a flying fuck that you bash it cause after all it's your right so you can write a thesis or a book if you want to (see if i care). It's just that there's enough idiots on this board (i do memorize all of their username) already and I often read but ignore their two cent comments. I only respond to those that I like after observing them for a while though. Perhaps you should go back and read my posts again cause i never said it was a "good" one.
4 years ago
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joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
i see that most of you fellas have missed the point here. read it in context man. we were discussing "the system, the constitutions, US voting system". Tradition, if you read me correctly, simply means that it's something that we have (ie voting system) and can't be changed. Are you sure you guys didn't mistake it for the " Traditional Value" crap that the rednecks/lame politicians/religious freaks are using all the time?
4 years ago
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Tyssen
Tyssen Pic3989 Posts
AustraliaBrisbane
In reply to
i see that most of you fellas have missed the point here. read it in context man. we were discussing "the system, the constitutions, US voting system". Tradition, if you read me correctly, simply means that it's something that we have (ie voting system) and can't be changed. Are you sure you guys didn't mistake it for the " Traditional Value" crap that the rednecks/lame politicians/religious freaks are using all the time?
No, you're missing the point. I may have used 'values' as examples (cos they were the most extreme), but just because a tradition is political in nature in no way means it can't be changed. In fact, I'd argue there is more reason for it to be changed cos this is the stuff that controls our lives and it needs to be in step with the times we live in, not some puritan, first fleet notions of the way the world should be.
4 years ago
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dB
spacefunky Pic7236 Posts
Canada
In reply to
In reply to
In reply to
No dB, its not about how much you say/write. its about how sound/logical/practical it is.


i never said it was... you were the one that mentioned the size of my statement.

 

as for sound: there are many... many different systems of democratic government that i would deem better than the american way. logical: i stated a logical arguement based on the flaws in your system of election.  since what i'm talking about is hypothetical in nature (because we both know that your electoral system won't change) practicallity doesn't come into play here.  although it would be practical and in your best interest to have your vote mean more on a smaller scale.

 

you still haven't said anything to opose this and debate why this system of election is a good one.


damn, buy some records, practice mixing, take up producing or something. At least take up a hobby if you don't love the music that much. we wouldn't have gotten this far posting this much if you were just simply explained why you think our voting system sucked with your first post (i wouldn't reply to to your post if you did that). Seriously, I don't give a flying fuck that you bash it cause after all it's your right so you can write a thesis or a book if you want to (see if i care). It's just that there's enough idiots on this board (i do memorize all of their username) already and I often read but ignore their two cent comments. I only respond to those that I like after observing them for a while though. Perhaps you should go back and read my posts again cause i never said it was a "good" one.


 

i've obviously said something that pissed you off.  you asked me to explain myself and after i did you decide that its a good idea to slag me for my opinion after saying that its my right to have one.

 

whatever happened to a polite debate buddy. 

 

we aren't talking about what my hobbies are, which infact include production and mixing records among many other musical endevours.  but i also have an interest in politics, philosophy and science.

 

apart from that if we had gotten into the conversation further i would have explained my problems with the canadian system of election (which is in constant revision in order to best represent the people of this nation!)

 

you need to chill out and relax a little... maybe take you own advice and go spin some disks.  if you don't feel like a debate don't ask for one.

4 years ago
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L - K - i
loki Pic4782 Posts
Viet Nam
In reply to

apart from that if we had gotten into the conversation further i would have explained my problems with the canadian system of election (which is in constant revision in order to best represent the people of this nation!)


the good side to the UK's regional division of power is for a "better" (read: in no ways the best) repesentation of the British Public . . . but according to region may not even be an accurate representation.  Using my previous example of the SNP having the most votes in Scotland last election, Labour won Scotland quite overwhelmingly. 

Im never up for a total domination of 1 or 2 parties ruling Parliament - it becomes a monopoly (yes, it pretty much is anyway). . . you definately need a widespread, and diversity of representation . . . and yes, this would include the less popular parties such as UKIP and BNP - because they still represent a certain part of the public who have every right to be heard just as much as everyone else in the country.

So how does the Canadian system work then, and how is it properly monitored (is there a public run committee or something?), and therefore revised - especially "constant" revision because I can see that causing confusion amongst voters without having some sort of uniformity. 


4 years ago
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joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
In reply to
In reply to
i see that most of you fellas have missed the point here. read it in context man. we were discussing "the system, the constitutions, US voting system". Tradition, if you read me correctly, simply means that it's something that we have (ie voting system) and can't be changed. Are you sure you guys didn't mistake it for the " Traditional Value" crap that the rednecks/lame politicians/religious freaks are using all the time?
No, you're missing the point. I may have used 'values' as examples (cos they were the most extreme), but just because a tradition is political in nature in no way means it can't be changed. In fact, I'd argue there is more reason for it to be changed cos this is the stuff that controls our lives and it needs to be in step with the times we live in, not some puritan, first fleet notions of the way the world should be.

There you go. Now we're seem to be on the right track. I agree that the electoral voting system is not a good one, but we can't just change it to popular voting because it's in the US's constitution (NRG Nutta agrees with me on this too). Things will get blown to hell because people will want to change everything else too. Whats your take on this?
4 years ago
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Quote
Tyssen
Tyssen Pic3989 Posts
AustraliaBrisbane
In reply to
I agree that the electoral voting system is not a good one, but we can't just change it to popular voting because it's in the US's constitution (NRG Nutta agrees with me on this too). Things will get blown to hell because people will want to change everything else too. Whats your take on this?
Just cos something seems too hard to do is not a good reason not to do it. I'm not suggesting making a full-scale change to your voting system in one fell sweep either. TBH I don't know enough about how it works to make any sensible comments anyway. But the US has made amendments to its constitution to before, so it's not out of the question that it could be done again to change the voting system.
In Australia, our parliament is dominated by the two main parties, but in recent elections (except the latest one), the balance of power in our upper house has been controlled by one of the minor parties which means that the governing party was often forced into making amendments to its legislation before they were passed which added an extra level of checking & balancing.
4 years ago
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Dan
DJDan Pic6459 Posts
United KingdomNarnia
Music Style Radio Jingles
oooh, deepparty
4 years ago
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joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
In reply to
In reply to
I agree that the electoral voting system is not a good one, but we can't just change it to popular voting because it's in the US's constitution (NRG Nutta agrees with me on this too). Things will get blown to hell because people will want to change everything else too. Whats your take on this?
Just cos something seems too hard to do is not a good reason not to do it. I'm not suggesting making a full-scale change to your voting system in one fell sweep either. TBH I don't know enough about how it works to make any sensible comments anyway. But the US has made amendments to its constitution to before, so it's not out of the question that it could be done again to change the voting system.
In Australia, our parliament is dominated by the two main parties, but in recent elections (except the latest one), the balance of power in our upper house has been controlled by one of the minor parties which means that the governing party was often forced into making amendments to its legislation before they were passed which added an extra level of checking & balancing.

cheers Uploaded Image
4 years ago
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joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
In reply to
oooh, deepparty

shut up Keiser, you cuntUploaded Image. what ever happen to the black dude wearing the suit (the pic). he looks funnier
4 years ago
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dB
spacefunky Pic7236 Posts
Canada
In reply to
In reply to
In reply to
i see that most of you fellas have missed the point here. read it in context man. we were discussing "the system, the constitutions, US voting system". Tradition, if you read me correctly, simply means that it's something that we have (ie voting system) and can't be changed. Are you sure you guys didn't mistake it for the " Traditional Value" crap that the rednecks/lame politicians/religious freaks are using all the time?
No, you're missing the point. I may have used 'values' as examples (cos they were the most extreme), but just because a tradition is political in nature in no way means it can't be changed. In fact, I'd argue there is more reason for it to be changed cos this is the stuff that controls our lives and it needs to be in step with the times we live in, not some puritan, first fleet notions of the way the world should be.

There you go. Now we're seem to be on the right track. I agree that the electoral voting system is not a good one, but we can't just change it to popular voting because it's in the US's constitution (NRG Nutta agrees with me on this too). Things will get blown to hell because people will want to change everything else too. Whats your take on this?

i think that everyone would agree that changing the system from the ground up would be an exercise in futility.  but small changes can still happen based on what you already have an more modern forms of election.  for example allow each state to vote in MP's and the party with the most MP's would make up the official government.
4 years ago
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Quote
dB
spacefunky Pic7236 Posts
Canada
In reply to
In reply to

apart from that if we had gotten into the conversation further i would have explained my problems with the canadian system of election (which is in constant revision in order to best represent the people of this nation!)


the good side to the UK's regional division of power is for a "better" (read: in no ways the best) repesentation of the British Public . . . but according to region may not even be an accurate representation.  Using my previous example of the SNP having the most votes in Scotland last election, Labour won Scotland quite overwhelmingly. 

Im never up for a total domination of 1 or 2 parties ruling Parliament - it becomes a monopoly (yes, it pretty much is anyway). . . you definately need a widespread, and diversity of representation . . . and yes, this would include the less popular parties such as UKIP and BNP - because they still represent a certain part of the public who have every right to be heard just as much as everyone else in the country.

So how does the Canadian system work then, and how is it properly monitored (is there a public run committee or something?), and therefore revised - especially "constant" revision because I can see that causing confusion amongst voters without having some sort of uniformity. 



the changes in the canadian system have been happening slowely for a long time.  i guess the reasons are that we have a small population as compaired to our size and certain economic reasons have forced change in the recent years.

at this point this is basically how it works:

Canada is divided up into 308 seats in parliment. and 105 senators.

the 308 ridings have changed since original confederation but it still has to change again... many people believe in representation by population.  its not quite like that right now but its close.

there are a number of different political parties it was 5 major parties until a merger just before our last election... so 4 now.  Liberal, Conservative, Bloc Quebecois, New Democratic Party.  there are others... including the Green party! smile
each riding then elects their own member of parliment based on what is best for their region of the country etc. and the party with the most seats makes up the official governing party.  the Leader of that party is the Prime Minister.

 

the good thing is that in an election year like this past one the official government does not have a majority... ie... they can't just go passing bills through parliment becuase they have the most seats.  they will need the votes from atleast one other party or it will be a vote of nonconfidence and we go back to the polls for another election.

4 years ago
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Quote
joe
3499 Posts
Fiji
In reply to
In reply to
In reply to
In reply to
No dB, its not about how much you say/write. its about how sound/logical/practical it is.


i never said it was... you were the one that mentioned the size of my statement.

 

as for sound: there are many... many different systems of democratic government that i would deem better than the american way. logical: i stated a logical arguement based on the flaws in your system of election.  since what i'm talking about is hypothetical in nature (because we both know that your electoral system won't change) practicallity doesn't come into play here.  although it would be practical and in your best interest to have your vote mean more on a smaller scale.

 

you still haven't said anything to opose this and debate why this system of election is a good one.


damn, buy some records, practice mixing, take up producing or something. At least take up a hobby if you don't love the music that much. we wouldn't have gotten this far posting this much if you were just simply explained why you think our voting system sucked with your first post (i wouldn't reply to to your post if you did that). Seriously, I don't give a flying fuck that you bash it cause after all it's your right so you can write a thesis or a book if you want to (see if i care). It's just that there's enough idiots on this board (i do memorize all of their username) already and I often read but ignore their two cent comments. I only respond to those that I like after observing them for a while though. Perhaps you should go back and read my posts again cause i never said it was a "good" one.


 

i've obviously said something that pissed you off.  you asked me to explain myself and after i did you decide that its a good idea to slag me for my opinion after saying that its my right to have one.

 

whatever happened to a polite debate buddy. 

 

we aren't talking about what my hobbies are, which infact include production and mixing records among many other musical endevours.  but i also have an interest in politics, philosophy and science.

 

apart from that if we had gotten into the conversation further i would have explained my problems with the canadian system of election (which is in constant revision in order to best represent the people of this nation!)

 

you need to chill out and relax a little... maybe take you own advice and go spin some disks.  if you don't feel like a debate don't ask for one.


yeah i'm so chill right now. take my own advice & about to go out party soon. read your follow up posts. i'm sure someone will take an interest discussing it with you soon
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